Our Reporter: Iheanacho Nwosu, Abuja
Barr. Charlie Agbo is a chieftain of the Peoples Democratic Party(PDP) in Enugu State. In this interview, he provided some insight into the crisis that is rocking the state chapter of the party, the endorsement of Hon. Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi and the chances of the party in the 2015 general election. Excerpts:
What do you make of the recent ruling by a Federal High Court in Abuja, recognising the Ajah leadership of Enugu PDP ?
It can only mean the fact of interpretation of that court. It has the right under the law to give the judgment. I do not share that position for several reasons. Before we get there, the first thing to do is to look at the effect of that judgment. The judgment does not entitle Ajah to assume the position for the fact that, even though ordinarily it ought to, there is a subsisting order of an Enugu High Court that restrains Ajah from parading himself as the Chairman of PDP in the state.
The order was given ex parte on November 7. And it was argued by way of motion on notice on November 7. The ruling was reserved for November 28. So, there is a valid action and valid injunction, restraining Ajah from parading himself as Chairman of the party. Technically, therefore, Ajah cannot assume the chairmanship of PDP in the state.
But the Enugu Order ought to elapse after seven days?
There is a motion on notice, the order has not been discharged at all, it is still subsisting.
Are you saying the order overrides the Abuja High court ruling?
It does not necessarily override it. They are courts of concurrent jurisdiction. They have equal effect independently. You are subject to the judgment of the Federal High Court as much as you are to that of the state High Court. If there is an injunction, restraining you from performing an act or from parading yourself as chairman of Enugu PDP and that injunction is still subsisting, you cannot parade yourself as chairman of PDP in Enugu State.
Where does this leave the Enugu PDP?
Where it leaves the Enugu PDP is something I wouldn’t want to call a flux. It is a wait and see situation because there are two conflicting rulings. Given the nature of our jurisprudence, they are equal and parties involved are subject to those decisions.
Do you share the position of some people that the crisis rocking the party in the state may affect its electoral fortunes in 2015?
The political process is never easy all over the world . Don’t forget that it is all about seeking relevance. It is a healthy contention. And any disputation in court helps to structure society. As far as I am concerned, it is to the benefit of society that actions are resolved in courts.
The PDP in Enugu is experiencing this tension now but ultimately, it will make the party stronger. For each matter that is resolved, you are not likely to have a repeat of such. The society gets better from such experiences. I do not see the party suffer anything. It is the ruling party and it has always been a tradition for some of these tensions to occur. I do not see the tension as having a permanent effect on the party. Eventually, the matter will be resolved. It is about contention for power and it is not a tea party.
What do you make of claims that if the state governor and the party in the state had not endorsed Hon Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi, the tension and standoff would not have been there?
The issue of endorsement of Ugwuanyi is being blown out of proportion. The party was trying to get a feeler as to the sentiments of the people. Last year, there was a motion that was moved in a stakeholders’ meeting indicating the interest of the party, on the strength of equity, to move the gubernatorial position to Enugu North. This zoning thing is part of the constitution. The constitution talked about the state having a right to ministerial slot etc. It is an inclusive provision to ensure that we have equity in the polity.
Back to Enugu, it was a collective decision to move towards a particular zone to guarantee equity and to carry everybody along both psychologically and socially.
Was it also a collective decision that the Governor should impose Ugwuanyi on the party?
The governor did not impose Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi on the party. There was a PDP stakeholders’ meeting that took place last year. A motion was moved by former Minister of state for foreign affairs , Dubem Onyia to the effect that, on the strength of equity and for strategic purposes, that if the party is to win the 2015 elections, it has to cede the governorship seat to Nsukka zone. Nsukka is very strategic, it is homogenous, it has many local governments and the zone controls the direction of votes. It has been consistent about that over the years.
Strategically, the party realised that if it is to win next year’s election, it has to move the gubernatorial slot to the zone. It was a collective decision. The decision was endorsed by leaders of the party in Enugu . It was not the decision of the governor at all. Then, as leader of the party, the governor began the process of giving effect to that decision by getting stakeholders to take a look at what they had intended to do. Systematically, several people who had lined up to contest the gubernatorial position, on their own began to withdraw for Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi on the strength of his qualities. Don’t forget that they are part of the same party; they interact and all of them know their relative strengths.
But some aspirants cried aloud, alleging that the process of Ugwuanyi’s endorsement was not decent; are you saying the aspirants were reflecting what transpired?
When you talk about decency, the matter was a public affair. It was not done in the secret. Everybody who was and is still important in PDP in the state was there. Nobody was shut out from that process. People who have held important positions in the country and in the party, on their own volition, withdrew for Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi. It is just commonsensical, logical that when you make a mental examination of your relative strength, you could place party above self and say yes, it would seem to me that as far as this moment is concerned, even though I am qualified, there are certain comparative advantages that the other person has above me. I think that was what happened. It was not the governor that foisted him on the party.
When you talk about pressure, you would need to identify anybody who was gagged to make a statement or somebody who was goaded to make a statement. There was none.
If every PDP member in the state accepted Ugwuanyi as you claim, how come that some members of the party are fighting his endorsement?
This is politics. You can never have absolute agreement. Concept of consensus does not mean absolute agreement. It never occurs anywhere in the world. And that is even though PDP has adopted President Jonathan as is done in most democracies where incumbent Presidents are returned because they have strategic advantages like name recognition, logistical advantages, but some people are still opposing the arrangement. Despite the qualities and advantages of President Jonathan’s candidacy, some people, if given the chance, would still oppose the arrangement.
Why is Enugu government opposed to Ajah’s leadership of PDP?
I do not think that the government of Enugu State is necessarily against the Ajah leadership. I think a mountain is being made out of a mole hill. Vita Abbah resigned, the law is clear on what should have followed. But because of extraneous forces, the thing became a little controversial. As far as I am concerned, I am yet to see how Enugu government can be faulted on this.
Part of the mandate of NWC of the party to Ajah was to organize an election within two weeks. Now, even as he approached the court, and got the ruling last week, the time he was expected to act in line with the constitution of the party had elapsed.
The state executive of a party is an independent body of the party. It is not attached in anyway, in direct legal term, to the National working committee. Both derive their relevance and authority from the constitution. They work together. But that is not to say that state executive committee takes directive from the NWC in strict sense. He does not necessarily have to wait for directive to do what is proper. There is a lacuna in the leadership of the party in the state, it is the duty of the state executive committee to address it.
The law of the party allows him two weeks within which to call a meeting; why was it difficult for the governor and his men to allow Ajah lead the party for that time frame before mounting pressure on him to quit?
That is the difference in trying to identify the real situation of things. In a real political situation, truth is very scarce. There are several interpretations of the situation. For you to stifle or stop a legitimate political party from functioning, you are likely to commit an offence. Nobody stopped Ajah from performing any act whatsoever. I would want to see him give evidence on how he was stopped by anybody from calling meetings.
I think that what happened is that he developed some mischievous intension after attending the first meeting. And of course, the press began spinning off all kinds of theories. I wouldn’t see how he would be stopped from performing a legitimate duty. Was it the police that stopped him from going to the party office to perform a legitimate duty? Nobody stopped him and nobody could have stopped him.
Where do you stand in the submission of some people that unless the governor reconciles with the Deputy Senate President, peace may not return to the Enugu PDP?
First of all , PDP is a political association. And all political associations require people to function. I will say if there is misconception or misunderstanding between the two, of course, logically, it needs to be resolved. It will lead to a better harmonious relationship. I do not know how much of the rift that the press talks about. I don’t have details of this rift. But I know that there are issues, particularly the ones in the court. Those conflicts are not unusual and they will eventually be resolved one way or another. Like I said, by the time you resolve a particular conflict , you are not likely to have it reoccur the next day. We are passing through an evolutionary process. The beautiful thing is that nobody has been killed. All you have is a conflict of ideas; it is about dialectics. They are all very helpful in a political environment.
Do you foresee Ugwuanyi and his promoters moving to the opposition party if those working against him in the PDP prevail at the end of the day?
I would not want that to happen because as a PDP member, my first inclination is the advancement of the party. But, then I cannot rule out possibilities in politics. About five governors left the party some months ago, these are all tendencies you expect in politics. Ugwuanyi is very popular and I can say without any fear of contradiction that he is one, if not the most popular candidates that Enugu State has produced in years. I personally fear that if, per chance he is constrained to move to another political party, that will be a loss to PDP because he will win. I wouldn’t want that to happen at all because it would not add to the fortunes of my party. PDP has, over the years, showcased capacity to contain crisis. When the crisis that saw off five governors began, it looked like hell had been let loose but as everybody can see, all of that is gradually being taken care of. That is what you would expect in a very big political party like the PDP.
Are you satisfied with the way the crisis is being handled by the NWC?
It is a transactional thing; it is in process. The resolution is in process and I want to believe that at the end of the day, everything would be sorted out. I want to repeat that I would not want a situation where any integral part of the party is ceded to any other political party. It will not augur well for the size and influence of the party. It has happened in a couple of places, it happened in Imo state . Some interests left the party and returned after they won election. I wouldn’t want that to happen to my party in Enugu. It is in everybody’s interest that every hand is placed on the deck to resolve these misunderstandings and disagreements . The tensions we are experiencing now have not gone out of hand , it is all about jaw jaw. .
http://sunnewsonline.com/new/?p=92510
Barr. Charlie Agbo is a chieftain of the Peoples Democratic Party(PDP) in Enugu State. In this interview, he provided some insight into the crisis that is rocking the state chapter of the party, the endorsement of Hon. Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi and the chances of the party in the 2015 general election. Excerpts:
What do you make of the recent ruling by a Federal High Court in Abuja, recognising the Ajah leadership of Enugu PDP ?
It can only mean the fact of interpretation of that court. It has the right under the law to give the judgment. I do not share that position for several reasons. Before we get there, the first thing to do is to look at the effect of that judgment. The judgment does not entitle Ajah to assume the position for the fact that, even though ordinarily it ought to, there is a subsisting order of an Enugu High Court that restrains Ajah from parading himself as the Chairman of PDP in the state.
The order was given ex parte on November 7. And it was argued by way of motion on notice on November 7. The ruling was reserved for November 28. So, there is a valid action and valid injunction, restraining Ajah from parading himself as Chairman of the party. Technically, therefore, Ajah cannot assume the chairmanship of PDP in the state.
But the Enugu Order ought to elapse after seven days?
There is a motion on notice, the order has not been discharged at all, it is still subsisting.
Are you saying the order overrides the Abuja High court ruling?
It does not necessarily override it. They are courts of concurrent jurisdiction. They have equal effect independently. You are subject to the judgment of the Federal High Court as much as you are to that of the state High Court. If there is an injunction, restraining you from performing an act or from parading yourself as chairman of Enugu PDP and that injunction is still subsisting, you cannot parade yourself as chairman of PDP in Enugu State.
Where does this leave the Enugu PDP?
Where it leaves the Enugu PDP is something I wouldn’t want to call a flux. It is a wait and see situation because there are two conflicting rulings. Given the nature of our jurisprudence, they are equal and parties involved are subject to those decisions.
Do you share the position of some people that the crisis rocking the party in the state may affect its electoral fortunes in 2015?
The political process is never easy all over the world . Don’t forget that it is all about seeking relevance. It is a healthy contention. And any disputation in court helps to structure society. As far as I am concerned, it is to the benefit of society that actions are resolved in courts.
The PDP in Enugu is experiencing this tension now but ultimately, it will make the party stronger. For each matter that is resolved, you are not likely to have a repeat of such. The society gets better from such experiences. I do not see the party suffer anything. It is the ruling party and it has always been a tradition for some of these tensions to occur. I do not see the tension as having a permanent effect on the party. Eventually, the matter will be resolved. It is about contention for power and it is not a tea party.
What do you make of claims that if the state governor and the party in the state had not endorsed Hon Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi, the tension and standoff would not have been there?
The issue of endorsement of Ugwuanyi is being blown out of proportion. The party was trying to get a feeler as to the sentiments of the people. Last year, there was a motion that was moved in a stakeholders’ meeting indicating the interest of the party, on the strength of equity, to move the gubernatorial position to Enugu North. This zoning thing is part of the constitution. The constitution talked about the state having a right to ministerial slot etc. It is an inclusive provision to ensure that we have equity in the polity.
Back to Enugu, it was a collective decision to move towards a particular zone to guarantee equity and to carry everybody along both psychologically and socially.
Was it also a collective decision that the Governor should impose Ugwuanyi on the party?
The governor did not impose Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi on the party. There was a PDP stakeholders’ meeting that took place last year. A motion was moved by former Minister of state for foreign affairs , Dubem Onyia to the effect that, on the strength of equity and for strategic purposes, that if the party is to win the 2015 elections, it has to cede the governorship seat to Nsukka zone. Nsukka is very strategic, it is homogenous, it has many local governments and the zone controls the direction of votes. It has been consistent about that over the years.
Strategically, the party realised that if it is to win next year’s election, it has to move the gubernatorial slot to the zone. It was a collective decision. The decision was endorsed by leaders of the party in Enugu . It was not the decision of the governor at all. Then, as leader of the party, the governor began the process of giving effect to that decision by getting stakeholders to take a look at what they had intended to do. Systematically, several people who had lined up to contest the gubernatorial position, on their own began to withdraw for Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi on the strength of his qualities. Don’t forget that they are part of the same party; they interact and all of them know their relative strengths.
But some aspirants cried aloud, alleging that the process of Ugwuanyi’s endorsement was not decent; are you saying the aspirants were reflecting what transpired?
When you talk about decency, the matter was a public affair. It was not done in the secret. Everybody who was and is still important in PDP in the state was there. Nobody was shut out from that process. People who have held important positions in the country and in the party, on their own volition, withdrew for Ifeanyi Ugwuanyi. It is just commonsensical, logical that when you make a mental examination of your relative strength, you could place party above self and say yes, it would seem to me that as far as this moment is concerned, even though I am qualified, there are certain comparative advantages that the other person has above me. I think that was what happened. It was not the governor that foisted him on the party.
When you talk about pressure, you would need to identify anybody who was gagged to make a statement or somebody who was goaded to make a statement. There was none.
If every PDP member in the state accepted Ugwuanyi as you claim, how come that some members of the party are fighting his endorsement?
This is politics. You can never have absolute agreement. Concept of consensus does not mean absolute agreement. It never occurs anywhere in the world. And that is even though PDP has adopted President Jonathan as is done in most democracies where incumbent Presidents are returned because they have strategic advantages like name recognition, logistical advantages, but some people are still opposing the arrangement. Despite the qualities and advantages of President Jonathan’s candidacy, some people, if given the chance, would still oppose the arrangement.
Why is Enugu government opposed to Ajah’s leadership of PDP?
I do not think that the government of Enugu State is necessarily against the Ajah leadership. I think a mountain is being made out of a mole hill. Vita Abbah resigned, the law is clear on what should have followed. But because of extraneous forces, the thing became a little controversial. As far as I am concerned, I am yet to see how Enugu government can be faulted on this.
Part of the mandate of NWC of the party to Ajah was to organize an election within two weeks. Now, even as he approached the court, and got the ruling last week, the time he was expected to act in line with the constitution of the party had elapsed.
The state executive of a party is an independent body of the party. It is not attached in anyway, in direct legal term, to the National working committee. Both derive their relevance and authority from the constitution. They work together. But that is not to say that state executive committee takes directive from the NWC in strict sense. He does not necessarily have to wait for directive to do what is proper. There is a lacuna in the leadership of the party in the state, it is the duty of the state executive committee to address it.
The law of the party allows him two weeks within which to call a meeting; why was it difficult for the governor and his men to allow Ajah lead the party for that time frame before mounting pressure on him to quit?
That is the difference in trying to identify the real situation of things. In a real political situation, truth is very scarce. There are several interpretations of the situation. For you to stifle or stop a legitimate political party from functioning, you are likely to commit an offence. Nobody stopped Ajah from performing any act whatsoever. I would want to see him give evidence on how he was stopped by anybody from calling meetings.
I think that what happened is that he developed some mischievous intension after attending the first meeting. And of course, the press began spinning off all kinds of theories. I wouldn’t see how he would be stopped from performing a legitimate duty. Was it the police that stopped him from going to the party office to perform a legitimate duty? Nobody stopped him and nobody could have stopped him.
Where do you stand in the submission of some people that unless the governor reconciles with the Deputy Senate President, peace may not return to the Enugu PDP?
First of all , PDP is a political association. And all political associations require people to function. I will say if there is misconception or misunderstanding between the two, of course, logically, it needs to be resolved. It will lead to a better harmonious relationship. I do not know how much of the rift that the press talks about. I don’t have details of this rift. But I know that there are issues, particularly the ones in the court. Those conflicts are not unusual and they will eventually be resolved one way or another. Like I said, by the time you resolve a particular conflict , you are not likely to have it reoccur the next day. We are passing through an evolutionary process. The beautiful thing is that nobody has been killed. All you have is a conflict of ideas; it is about dialectics. They are all very helpful in a political environment.
Do you foresee Ugwuanyi and his promoters moving to the opposition party if those working against him in the PDP prevail at the end of the day?
I would not want that to happen because as a PDP member, my first inclination is the advancement of the party. But, then I cannot rule out possibilities in politics. About five governors left the party some months ago, these are all tendencies you expect in politics. Ugwuanyi is very popular and I can say without any fear of contradiction that he is one, if not the most popular candidates that Enugu State has produced in years. I personally fear that if, per chance he is constrained to move to another political party, that will be a loss to PDP because he will win. I wouldn’t want that to happen at all because it would not add to the fortunes of my party. PDP has, over the years, showcased capacity to contain crisis. When the crisis that saw off five governors began, it looked like hell had been let loose but as everybody can see, all of that is gradually being taken care of. That is what you would expect in a very big political party like the PDP.
Are you satisfied with the way the crisis is being handled by the NWC?
It is a transactional thing; it is in process. The resolution is in process and I want to believe that at the end of the day, everything would be sorted out. I want to repeat that I would not want a situation where any integral part of the party is ceded to any other political party. It will not augur well for the size and influence of the party. It has happened in a couple of places, it happened in Imo state . Some interests left the party and returned after they won election. I wouldn’t want that to happen to my party in Enugu. It is in everybody’s interest that every hand is placed on the deck to resolve these misunderstandings and disagreements . The tensions we are experiencing now have not gone out of hand , it is all about jaw jaw. .
http://sunnewsonline.com/new/?p=92510
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